Now here's a cool idea...look at this!

http://www.duboisi.com/diy/BNdiygrotto/bndiygrotto.htm

Awesome link !! I was just talking to Les about doing this exact thing but I was to use plexiglass. but it is the same thing I love it.

Cool idea. I still have concerns with using gutters though undecided I'm sure that the fish really enjoy the caves though.

I was thinking at one point using quik crete. But I gave up on the idea . Sounds like alot can cause problems. This idea on the link is pretty cool. Thanks for sharing.
Pete

I'd like to figure out something similar without the metal gutters, but same idea...I just saw these in a link on C-F, any other thoughts? small plastic cups with ends cut off? Not sure that would look real natural though

For those that have concerns with using PVC gutters - rinse them under hot water to remove any hydrocarbons that might off-gas or leach out under aquarium conditions. After doing so, there should be very little of anything left to leach into the aqaurium. For a secondarly level of protection, add fresh activated carbon to the aquarium to adsorb and absorb any residual hydrocarbons.

The material is similar to the PVC piping used for wet/dry filters, and PVC canister filter hoses so I'm confident it will be fine. I'd much prefer to use it instead of aluminum, personally.

Excellent points Trainer.. This topic resparked my fire to do a backround. I think using PVC will be a better base material to use just because it is a more fish friendly item IMO. one thing I need more information on is this Black "aquarium safe" sealer they mentioned in the article. I've never used the black stuff before. heck I don't think I've ever seen it before either.

I guess I didn't read close enough. I thought we were talking about aluminum here. PVC works fine IME.

If you wanted to do this on a glass tank, would you be able to use the zip tie method?? Doesn't appear to work with glass. This is my problem, lets say you have to silicone the background to the tank. If a fish dies behind your background, how do you get him out??

I could be reading the post wrong, but seems it would only work on acrylic tank. Please correct me if I'm wrong anyone.

I've always been fascinated with the diy backgrounds like this, saw this thread a long time ago and thought about doing it. But when I did my research, I learned that most people with these kind of backgrounds only use them for a short while and remove them, due to problems with excessive debris building up, and the dead fish thing.

Anyone here using one long term successfully??? I think they look fantastic, but it just seems like alot of trouble for something that is going to cause problems and have to be removed!

Kim

Kim, that's exactly what's holding me back...how would you know if there's a dead fish in there? I count my fish twice a day to make sure...and believe me I have to go searching at times...but if something ever did die back there, it would be a pain to find which hole...I'm trying to figure out a way that might work differently, but the same.

Fanman...yes this can be used in glass...it stated towards bottom of write up that you'd have to make 'hooks' or something to hang it either over top of glass or through 'black' plastic trim. I don't want a permanent backdrop in my aquarium in case I don't like it and want to change...so that's why I'm looking into 'hanging' type backdrops!

i've always wondered about using acrylic sheets for a background. you could " sand the sheets to make them opaque, then you could silicone your material to the acrylic. using lava or feather rock would keep the weight down, so that it would be managable. if you wanted you could use plastic blocks to build up and make caves or arches. then take sand and fill in around the rocks to make it look even more natural. that way you could get away from toxic material. i dont know if it would work, but at least that way you could fit it flat against the back of the tank. fish wouldnt be able to get behind it and die, because it would be flat. and you could just leave the sheet covered in sand where the filter intake and heater will be. you could even leave the bottom two inches bare, that way debries wont get caught against it. i'm not really into "backgrounds" other than a nice green algae coat, but it seems like it should work.
mongo

I saw this and my little brain went to turning....I love the backdrop. What if you were to secure the bottom w/ a "foot"? Two flat pieces of material w/ a little weight to them, that is attached to the backdrop bottom. Then cover that w/ the gravel or sand. And the top can have a little extra support w/ those little suction cups w/ zip ties???? I am no artist but I think you can see what I am discribing.....